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[quote]salam
This discussion is stuck........

The idea of a thing cannot prove the existence of a thing. I dont know why Mr. Aijaz is stressing on such a hypothesis.

There are three types of arguments to prove the existence of God, Cosmological, Teleological and Ontological. Each of the three is proved to have logical fallacies in them. Allama Iqbal stressed on their flaws in his famous “Reconstruction of religious thought in Islam”. So it can be said with certainty that there can be no logical and philosophical argument to prove the existence of God.

But God does exist.

First of all, we only know things which have identical examples. For example we know there is a city named as Tokyo; we can comprehend that because we have seen another city. But God has nothing like Him. So as long as we don’t see God, or something like Him, we cannot comprehend Him by ourselves.

Hence, answer this question. Is it possible for a thing to exist, which has no example like itself, for us to comprehend it?

If you say no, what are your reasons?

If you ask me, I can’t deny the existence of such a thing, simply because I don’t know any reason to deny it at all.

Secondly, if such a thing does exist, let’s say it is God, and He wants the human beings to be aware of his existence, what would be the method for this?

He can show Himself to all human beings to appreciate his existence, or he can show Himself to the first man and communicate with His selected men afterwards to clear things up.

Now we don’t know about seeing the God, neither we have any proof that anyone else has seen Him. But we have all known history and also the pre-history of how He communicated with the first man and then His selected men afterwards.

Even this does not prove His existence, but all I am stressing here is the “possibility” of His existence.

Now we know that the idea of God is always present in all human communities and civilizations throughout the known history and pre-history. There never was a society of Atheists in all human history. Hence he who asserts that there is no God, must bring his arguments.

If I say that God exists, I don’t have to give you proof for it, because I am not stating a philosophical idea. I am stating a historical fact, something that has been done. Historical facts cannot be proven with philosophical arguments. For example who can prove philosophically that Karl Marx wrote “Das Kapital”? Ask yourself why you believe that he wrote it?

You believe he wrote that book because every human being conveyed this knowledge to you, generation after generation, from the era when Marx was alive till your age. This is a historical fact, not an idea which can be proved philosophically. To prove this historical fact (by negating its nature as an incident) only by philosophical means, is wrong. Historical facts cannot be proved philosophically.

Precisely is the case about the existence of God. I am presenting it as a historical fact, not as an idea. Therefore now anyone who denies the existence of God must bring his arguments.

Regards.[/quote]

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