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The Qur'an and the Sunnah
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[quote][size=2]Asalam Alaikum, Thanks brother for ur kind reply: Quote: Then in short you agreed that ‘Muhammad was not the last messenger’, isn’t it? Reply: I agree if the context is so as I mentioned, but I consider prophet Muhammad (pbuh) as last messenger too, for the following reasons. U know well brother, nowhere it is mentioned that “Quran” is last book of Allah, but yet we all consider it is last because of the following verses of holy Qura’n, in short, (1) a) "The people used to be one community when God sent THE **PROPHETS** as bearers of good news, as well as warners. HE SENT DOWN WITH THEM THE SCRIPTURE, bearing the truth, to judge among the people in their disputes" [2:213] b)[57/25] We verily sent Our **messengers** with clear proofs, and revealed with them THE BOOK and the Balance, that mankind may observe right measure. (2): [5:03]....This day have I perfected your religion for you and completed My favour unto you, and have chosen for you as religion al-Islam.... (3) :[33:40] Muhammad was not the father of any man among you. He was a messenger of GOD and the final prophet. GOD is fully aware of all things. 1>> we see that the duty of a prophet and a messenger is same, and both have been given books, messages, clear proofs for guidance of mankind, therefore both are TWO TERMS USED INTERCHANGEABLY IN QURAN and two INSEPARABLE facets of one same person/thing. 2>> Allah has completed his religion for guidance of mankind, and he (human being) has no need for any further guidance in obeying Allah. 3>> it is finally stamped that no prophet will come after Prophet Muhammad. In conclusion, We see that both have been given same duty, scriptures, proofs, …etc, therefore they are same, and in last (3) if there is no any prophet to come, then surely there will be no book, no messenger, no further guiandace…etc in future. Quote: Almighty Allah can inspire any creature e.g. He inspired the Bee. Also He inspired the mother of Moses…, but these inspirations have no value towards our religious Rules, Regulations, Rituals ….. Reply: Brother r u sure what u r going to say, I read page 19 of this forum, where u r seen discussing with brother Usmani, and u have the following comments:- {The above verses do not say that Shu’aib received SCRIPTURE from GOD, the words in this verse (7:93) say that Shu’aib said to his people “ O my people, I have delivered to you the messages of my Lord”…. If you read 7:85 you will know that these messages were: 1-Worship GOD, you have no other god beside Him. 2-You shall give full weight and full measure when you trade. 3-Do not cheat the people out of their rights. 4-Do not corrupt the earth after it has been set straight. [7:67] He said, "O my people, there is no foolishness in me; I am a messenger from the Lord of the universe. [7:68] "I deliver to you my Lord's messages, and I am honestly advising you. [7:69] "Is it too much of a wonder that a message should come to you from your Lord, through a man like you, to warn you? Recall that He made you inheritors after the people of Noah, and multiplied your number. Remember GOD's blessings, that you may succeed." These verses also do not say that Hood received scripture from GOD. The words in 7:68 say that Messenger Hood said to his people “ I deliver to you my Lord’s messages”… and if you read 7:65 you will also know that these messages were: "O my people, worship GOD; you have no other god beside Him…….”} Brother, does these messages (cited above) have no value towards our religious Rules, Regulations, Rituals…etc, u agree that Shou’ab And Hood did not receive scripture i.e recited verses, but u mean both received INSPIRATION, is’nt?. Then how these inspirations become valuable to the nation of Shouab and Hood, if inspirations have no value to our religios rules…etc?? Very sad brother, how u become blind to ur own statements, this is seeing able. In addition to this, when these both messengers were died, then how their nations followed their messages? Furthermore, I have seen that u consider prophet as messenger because of a scripture, yet some times u disagree that all messengers have not been scriptures. Very strange!, a prophet becomes a messenger because of a SCRIPTRE, THEN HOW A MESSENGER CAN BE CALLED A MESSENGER WITHOUT A SCRIPTURE/MESSAGE… WHAT A LOGIC! hahahaha. Quote: Furthermore, we are told that THE ACCEPTANCE OF ANY OTHER SOURCES besides Qur’an for religious guidance equals to the setting up of OTHER GODS BESIDE GOD: >>> Such type of verses are addressed to Prophet Muhammad (himself) specially, Can Muhammad obey himself?, what we are told see the following:- Surah Aaraf(7:157) Those who follow the messenger, the Prophet who can neither read nor write, whom they will find described in the Torah and the Gospel (which are) with them. He will enjoin on them that which is right and forbid them that which is wrong. He will make lawful for them all good things and prohibit for them only the foul; and he will relieve them of their burden and the fetters that they used to wear. Then those who believe in him, and honour him, and help him, and [b]follow the light which is sent down with him: they are the successful. [/b] {157} Here obeying of Messenger is separately mentioned, before the obeying of message i.e Quran which is later mentioned separately in the end of this verse, if these are same then y allah mentioned it later. Therefore obeying of Messenger is separate, besides the obeying of Quran i.e message. And this is also true that we people have been said to follow Quran too, therefore u are applying one part of obediency n refuse to obey the second part i.e obeying of a messenger/prophet. Quote: Messenger when delivered God’s message could not make any mistakes, but messenger as a human had done mistakes.. Reply: y ? , was he not a human when he delivered God’s message? Or became angel during delivering the words of God. Quote:…… This command is regarding the judgment (of any matter) of Muhammad when he judged as person Muhammad and when his judgement was right then they(those people who came to him) would have to obey it and when he was wrong then they did not have to obey that. Reply: it means u agree that when he judges right, we are bound to obey him?, then what this obediency is of Prophet Muhammad as personal. Quote: Qur’an never says about any un-recited revelation, taking them as religious source and Qur’an never says about hadith, sunnah(fabricated and attributed them to Muhammad), taking them as religious source. Reply: (un-recited revelations, i have quoted ur own said stat. abt Shouab & Hood, Plz give response),Obedincy of Prophet Muhammad brought these things i.e sunnah, hadith, and obedience of him, is our religious source mentioned in several places of Holy Quran. Quote: How could you know that Muhammad had not included in it(the covenant)??? Reply: Here people are told about a prophet who is standing among them, Allah is reminding them the previous covenant with previous prophets. If I here agree that prophet Muhammad was included yet, it does not mean, that the next “ afterward” messenger is not Muhammad. Suppose brother, u know that Allah took covenant from all people also, yet people are coming or taking birth on this earth after one by one. If prophet Muhammad was also included in this covenant yet he has to come at his time, because he was called a prophet at that time. And u agreed that every prophet is also a messenger. Because according to u, u can call a prophet a messenger. Is’nt?(I think u will try to understand, because I coud not explain it more fully because of less vocabulary). Quote: Brother, I think this covenant is taken from ALL PROPHETS, but not in this world, because all prophets did not come in this world at a time. So this covenant had taken in heaven as the Almighty Allah took the covenant from us. Reply: Brother u think that for taking covenant, is it necessary, that all should be gathered at a time, no brother It is not nessary, Supose brother, Allah took covenant from Noah (as) hundred thousands years ago, when he was sent to his nation, after more thousands years later, Allah took covenant from Abraham, when he was sent to his nation, after the few years later Allah took covenant from Jesus (as) so… then here in last, can Allah not say that he took covenants from the prophets? Is’nt. (this is just for argument sake example) where as I believe that this was a reminder mentioned in as future tense as brother Usmani explained very well. In last i would like to say that if any one has still a dout to follow Sunnah, he should read all pages of this forum, he will find that brother samsher is failed to prove the Quran only sorece for guiadance of humankind. Thanks, Allah Hafiz Cares… [/size=2][/quote]
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