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perv1
UNITED KINGDOM
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 Posted - Sunday, November 12, 2006 - 8:15 PM 
Salaam Oosman
thank you I think you forgot to add this one to complete the third of my points
quote:
That during the battle with Bani Al-Mustaliq they (muslims) captured some females
and intended to have sexual relation with them without impregnating them. So they
asked the Prophet about coitus interrupt us. The Prophet said: 'It is better that you
should not do it, for Allah has written whom He is going to create till the Day of
Resurrection.' Qaza'a said: 'I heard Abu Sa'id saying that the Prophet said:
'No soul is ordained to be created but Allah will create it.'
(Sahih Boekhari - Volume 9, Book 93, Number 506)
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perv1
UNITED KINGDOM
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Posted - Sunday, November 12, 2006 - 8:15 PM
Salaam Oosman
thank you I think you forgot to add this one to complete the third of my points
quote:
That during the battle with Bani Al-Mustaliq they (muslims) captured some females
and intended to have sexual relation with them without impregnating them. So they
asked the Prophet about coitus interrupt us. The Prophet said: 'It is better that you
should not do it, for Allah has written whom He is going to create till the Day of
Resurrection.' Qaza'a said: 'I heard Abu Sa'id saying that the Prophet said:
'No soul is ordained to be created but Allah will create it.'
(Sahih Boekhari - Volume 9, Book 93, Number 506)
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sahira
UNITED KINGDOM
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Posted - Monday, November 13, 2006 - 10:55 AM
brother perv, when Quran sharif itself allowed men to has sexual realtions with their slave girs or captives why do you have a problem if it is staed in the hdiths, you dont obobject it from the quran but you do when its from the hdiths.
sura23,5-6 (Al-Mu'minûn)
5. And those who guard their chastity (i.e. private parts, from illegal sexual acts)
6. Except from their wives or (the captives and slaves) that their right hands possess, for then, they are free from blame;
The Quran in Sura 23:5-6 says:
5 [Most certainly true believers] . . . guard their private parts scrupulously, 6 except with regard to their wives and those who are legally in their possession, for in that case they shall not be blameworthy. (Sayyid Abul A’La Maududi, The Meaning of the Quran, vol. 3, p. 237)
The key words are "those who are legally in their possession." Maududi (d. 1979) is a highly respected commentator on the Quran, and he interprets the plain meaning of the clause, saying that sex with slave-girls is lawful.
Maududi writes:
Two categories of women have been excluded from the general command of guarding the private parts: (a) wives, (b) women who are legally in one’s possession, i.e. slave-girls. Thus the verse clearly lays down the law that one is allowed to have sexual relation with one’s slave-girl as with one’s wife, the basis being possession and not marriage. If marriage had been the condition, the slave-girl also would have been included among the wives, and there was no need to mention them separately. (Ibid. p. 241, note 7) |
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perv1
UNITED KINGDOM
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Posted - Monday, November 13, 2006 - 11:43 AM
salaam saihra
I am not trying to avoid your question I will give you a detailed reply as to what the Quran actually says. I am very busy at the moment so only few minutes here and there so cannot fully respond but please be patient
quote:
brother perv, when Quran sharif itself allowed men to has sexual realtions with their slave girs or captives why do you have a problem if it is staed in the hdiths, you dont obobject it from the quran but you do when its from the hdiths.
The problem is so few have proper understanding of what the Quran says that what the male dominated societeis, whose root lay in paganism, that even the Quran has been mistranslated to suit their needs. I promise I will come back to this in next few days as it is a very crucial issue and it is important it is dealt with properly. Believe me if the Quran allowed this free for all there would be very little moral basis for Islam
regards |
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Rakhtal
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Monday, November 13, 2006 - 12:36 PM
quote:
Please read the whole verse before making such comments. The answer to your question is in the remaing part of the verse.
Thanx
Then why some muslims misguides others by choosing the selected portions of the verses? |
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sahira
UNITED KINGDOM
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Posted - Monday, November 13, 2006 - 2:06 PM
| ok brother perv take your time, i would like to point out the translation i gave you does not necessairly mean i agree with but my point being is translations like that are around and people do take on face value, same can be said on the hadiths people have written thing that have been taken out of context or misleading translations. i like you belive in the Quran as word of Allah SWT the true scripture of islam,but i do use the hadiths as say like a refrence book if you get what im saying, i can never take everything from the hadiths like its Allah SWT word as this is not the case and we recognise that it just better explains things as in like how much zakat to give, rituals of hajj and what is the way in doing things made faraz on us from the holy Quran. |
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Puppy
UNITED KINGDOM
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Posted - Tuesday, November 14, 2006 - 12:46 PM
quote:
salaam brothers i will try to answer your queations InshaAllah feel a bit ganged up on but no worries. ok first to brother marwan salaam, you started this debate asking if islam has become Mohammadanism nad i said you was genralising as to how do you define majority by minority to this brother aboosait gave links to pics of tombs and graves and grave worshipping...my answer to this is you only get jiyal people doing these acts they happen all over the world but an educated muslim would not practice this shirk.
now brother you have written a ver lenghty essay which i have not fully read as right from the begining of your post the dicussion has changed from your original question to debate about Quran and sunnah and if you llok on the forum we already have a debate going about this so maybe you need to post there as you have gone of the original discussion.
brother abboosait salaam, im not ignoring what brother perv pointed out and agree with you it is pretty bad in places but like i mentioned above thats a different discussion and if theis thread was started based on onlt those pictures to prove islam is going mohammdanism then you dont have much of an argument.
regarding your question if i take everything associated to the Prophet PBUH as hadiths well my answer to that is no i know hadiths is man made tis why i choose to read and follow authntic hadiths with have been agreed upon by the majority schools of thought.
alos brother Perv, the hadiths validate the character of the Prophet PBUH because we hear about his good character through people who associated with him lived with him personally knew him...yes hadtihs is man made and is made from words taken by people and passed down hundreds and hundreds of years, so naturally mistakes can be made with wording ect but the genral jist of it is the same you know this by studying work of different scholors and comparing majority of the outcome will be the same.You cursed and bastard Perv 1 admitted that bitch when on a heat attracts lot of males and it is not clear who the father of the resultant offspring is. it is confirmed and endorsed by yourself own, your father is an un-known Dog and your mother is a Bitch How many brothers [dogs] and sister [bitches] you are? brothers wether hadiths is right or wrong is a different dabate and a very indebth and intense one if you look at the thread on quran and sunnah. you've been taught to belive hadiths is wrong, and i belive it right untill im proved otherwise and i cant see that happening. the other point i would like to make is i belive in hadiths but i dont compare it to Quran sharif, i dont take hadiths on just hadiths value it has to be quoted from the quran stuff that i look up, i guess i use tha hadiths to have better understanding of how to practice in the best poss way but when i want to know about my religion obviously i would study the quran for this. so what im saying is all of us who do belive in the hadiths first turn to the quran then hadiths, iv rambled on abit im not even sure im making any sense here. but i hope you understand what imtrying to say.
Well done sister!!!! |
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sahira
UNITED KINGDOM
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Posted - Tuesday, November 14, 2006 - 10:15 PM
puppy you add stuff to my post and then said well done, you use my post to swear at perv1 how very dare you.
all i want to say to you is its abvious you dont get on with many formers here so the best thing to do is if you dont agree with their points then ignore there is no point swearing and lowering yourself like that. argue your point constructivley or just walk away you dont need to get personal and start abusing people. the whole point is having debates and learning.im requesting that you refrain from verbal abuse you seem like an intelligent person just stop letting people get to you please. |
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SACHIN
INDIA
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Posted - Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 7:12 AM
quote:
It strikes me that Muslims are just one step behind Christians on the issue of how they treat Muhammad, when they Call Jesus God, but Muslims are actually worse than Christians in some things.
Christians say that Jesus is God.
Muhammadans say that Muhammad is the best creation, that is, he is no. 2 after Allah. That he knows the future, can guide us to Jannah. That the universe was created so Muhammad could exist etc...
Christians tell us how great the character of Jesus is.
Muhammadans tell us how Muhammad was the kindest, best looking, wisest, most important, most generous and all around most amazing being to ever exist after Allah.
Christians try to follow guidance ascribed to Jesus who they think of as God.
Muhammadans make it their religion to follow everything that is ASCRIBED centuries after the prophet, in his words and actions, even when they contradict reason, evidence and the Qur'an (1 example, punishment for adultery another, regarding the sufficiency of the Qur'an etc...). That is, they put the alleged words of the prophet so high that they will abandon the Qur'an in their favour. This is worse than the Christians because whereas the Christians at least believe that what they are following is revelation of God, Muslims actually call it the guidance of Muhammad, a man.
Christian say Jesus performed many miracles.
Muhammadans say Muhammad performed many miracles (apart from the Qur'an and apart from any evidence from the Qur'an)
etc etc etc...
I have long since kept note of all the Muhammad worship hadith and sayings of scholars.
It is my contention that there is always a trend to corrupt religion among its followers. It happened with the Jews, the Christians and everyone else before Muhammad, so why not Islam?
Only difference, is that whereas before the revelation was altered and other sources added. In Islam, only the other sources were added, the hadith.
Any opinions?
Edited by: marwan on Wednesday, November 08, 2006 7:23 PM
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SACHIN
INDIA
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Posted - Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 7:34 AM
Salam, Marwan
You are filled with many prejudices about Islam.Have you ever seen a photograph of Muhammad(SAW)?.Had Islam been Muhammdanism you would have found Him(SAW) being worshipped in one or other form in every muslim abode.Just see your own inner and think how do you worship an apostle of God with a figurative assignment. Just think can God take a human form and also pass through all stages of life. First please go through Surah Al-Ikhlas and correct your concept of God, and than pose such questions.How an astrayed can find errors in the path of others i do not understand.
Allah hafiz
Edited by: SACHIN on Sunday, November 19, 2006 7:47 AM |
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marwan
UNITED KINGDOM
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Posted - Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 11:33 AM
you dont have to see someone to worship him.
Muhammadans are idolators and kafirs. they have taken as guider and protector an arab who died a long time ago. A man who couldnt solve a quadratic equation or anything like that.
They have corrupted and destroyed the deen of islam |
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raushan
UNITED ARAB EMIRATES
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Posted - Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 12:10 PM
quote:
Muhammadans are idolators and kafirs. they have taken as guider and protector an arab who died a long time ago. A man who couldnt solve a quadratic equation or anything like that.
They have corrupted and destroyed the deen of islam
thats all about muslims and mohammadans.
and what about submitters? |
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aboosait
INDIA
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Posted - Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 1:37 PM
A man who couldnt solve a quadratic equation or anything like that.
WHO DO YOU MEAN ? ? |
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marwan
UNITED KINGDOM
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Posted - Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 1:51 PM
| I am not a part of their group. if they are guilty of similar crimes then they are as bad |
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marwan
UNITED KINGDOM
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Posted - Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 1:54 PM
you are correct aboosait.
I should refer to all the liars who made up and trsmaitted the hadith in the name of the prophet. But through such hadith they have made muhammad much more than he was and so they worship him in the same style as the jews and christians worshipped their priests and rabbis. |
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sahira
UNITED KINGDOM
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Posted - Monday, November 20, 2006 - 11:56 AM
QUOTE BY MARWAN :you dont have to see someone to worship him.
Muhammadans are idolators and kafirs. they have taken as guider and protector an arab who died a long time ago. A man who couldnt solve a quadratic equation or anything like that.
They have corrupted and destroyed the deen of islam
now that is offensive, remark like that againdt the Prophet PBUH uou dont belive in hadiths but dont have to insult the Prophet PBUH |
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