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usmani790
PAKISTAN
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 Posted - Tuesday, February 20, 2007 - 4:07 AM 
Quote:-tUM MUSALMAAN HO KYAA YEH ANDAAZI MUSALMAANI HEH.
When we looks for wisdom in the sayings kafir's scholars more than in the sayings of our own Prophet(pbuh), then for him the defination of Muslim would also not remain as it is defind by prophet(pbuh).So no complaint as this was expected.
Edited by: usmani790 on Tuesday, February 20, 2007 4:40 AM |
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waseem
UNITED KINGDOM
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Posted - Tuesday, February 20, 2007 - 6:52 AM
Point taken brother usmani. I apologise and withdraw my sher. Many thanks.
I would like to you to elaborate what non muslim activity is Ghamidhi propogating that makes him and people who agree with him non muslim.
Ghamidhi does not reject the 4 schools of thought. His stance is that we must accept that they are all human beings andnot prophets. Their interpretations are also likely to have some errors. Instaed of agreeing blindly and totally with one , he quotes all 4 and clearly says where he agrees with who.
Ghamidhi's stance is that no scholar of Islam including himself can be mistake free and considered like a prophet. We must use our intellect and knowledge to decide.
Ijtehaad is human interpretation and can be different for different individuals. |
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raushan
UNITED ARAB EMIRATES
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Posted - Tuesday, February 20, 2007 - 7:15 AM
quote:
Quote:-Muslims are doing much on daily basis to make a negative impression of not only muslims but Islam also.
So is that not enough for you so wants our schalors also must participate in it.
That is an overstatement brother.
I am afraid you have decided it unintentionally that this or this type of programmes will make a negative impression.we must have some good reasons for that conclusion.
Its a good idea to deal with the matters intellectually and in a decent manner before public so that everyone can have access of that easily.I think it will impress "others"who are already under impression that Islam too have pontiffs and whose views are only meant for people who are already agreed to them without questioning them. |
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raushan
UNITED ARAB EMIRATES
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Posted - Tuesday, February 20, 2007 - 7:26 AM
quote:
To me is a sin to tolerate this kind of deviation people are coming with here.Prophet(pbuh) have asked us to use our hand to stop it, if you can not then use your tounge and if one not even can not use the tounge then the last thing is to feel bad about it in your heart.This is the last stage of Iman.
May Allah makes us understand our duties and give us courge to use it.
Again'kind of deviation' requires something otherwise it can be taken as a "blame"which can be made against anyone without any supporting evidence.
The solution is already given in your quoted Hadith,use your tongue to refute something you feel wrong.Only accusation is not enough,it is a sin,I hope you agree. |
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salmant
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Tuesday, February 20, 2007 - 7:28 AM
Quote: Is there any thing specific that you feel about Javaid Ahmad Ghamidhi's views that you feel negatively about.
Reply: I have great respect for Mr. Ghamidi for the scholarly contributions he has done and is doing towards Islamic literature. However, as he himself suggests, whatever he says is also one opinion, which can be questioned, criticized and debated upon. My basic concern regarding the program "Ghamidi" was, lack of objectivity, either because of the format or the way discussion is being managed. I just wanted to know if people felt the same way (if they had seen the program) about that program or they had different views.
Usmani wrote: One thing I will admit here, I very seldom have chance to see these programmes.
Reply: Thanks brother Usmani for admitting that. I suggest you watch these programs, and then suggest what can be done to improve these - And even incase you still feel these programs shouldnt be done, your reasons for believing that would be more clear to us.
Waseem wrote: Ghamidhi's stance is that no scholar of Islam including himself can be mistake free and considered like a prophet. We must use our intellect and knowledge to decide.
Reply: I think a relevant problem to discuss here is that of 'Taqleed'. Whether it is a valid way of following religion?. Ghamidi Sb holds the opinion that it is not. As far as I have observed, Mr. Ghamidi does respect the four Imams immensely, but he does not subscribe to any one Imam specifically because he thinks that ultimate authority of describing religion is with Quran and Sunnah only (and no other person, be a scholar, a sufi, or jurist is the final authority in religion). The interpretations of these two sources can differ, infact they have differed in the past. Which interpretation to choose, will depend on whose interpretation satisfys you to be more compatible with Quran and Sunnah.
Regards,
Salman |
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raushan
UNITED ARAB EMIRATES
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Posted - Tuesday, February 20, 2007 - 7:42 AM
quote:
Quote:-we respect four school of thoughts because they have common roots.
You may respect but I heard my self Ghamdi sahib opposing to follow any school out of four.
I have respect for sufism but I oppose the ways they prescribe for seeker,you have seen it recently.
On the other note,if Ghamdi sahib or anyone who says something is not final but only have a status of "opinion''. The opinion will only be reliable if its supported with enough evidence from Quran and Sunnah and finally it would have a degree of acceptence only when it satisfies the seeker.That again has many dimensions. |
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ibrahim
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Tuesday, February 20, 2007 - 8:35 AM
quote:
The moderator is directed to edit the relevant text only.
Sorry Brother,
1) U r NOT my BOSS to give me Direction OR i'm BOUND to Obey U
2) There is NOTHING to EDIT in your POSTs. is there ANY?
What's the opinion of our Respected Participants?
By the way, Whenever I see a Good thing in your post OR in the POSTs of others, I leave them BUT if there is NOTHING in it & ONLY some REMARKS or some Irrelevant material, I've the PERMISSION to DELETE it. Is there any Objection? |
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raushan
UNITED ARAB EMIRATES
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Posted - Tuesday, February 20, 2007 - 8:44 AM
The spirit of tolerating others view can be seen even in our recent past among the scholars.we have much to learn if we want.
I can recollect something from Malfoozaat e thanwi:
During khilafat moovement when he refuse to join his seniors.The senior didnt issue any fatwa against him or say bad but he praised instead and felt proud that this man is also from their jamaat.
When someone ask what naseeruddin dehlvi say about his sheikh on listening sama'.The honest mureed replied, it is against sharia.And when it reached to the sheikh ,he said naseeruddin is right(raast).
Disagreement also serve the purpose to keep a check on all,,be right someone following you with open eyes and mind. |
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usmani790
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Tuesday, February 20, 2007 - 10:05 AM
Quote:-do not go on asking for more references again and again which have been given in the relevant courses and articles already.
The reply which was given by me earlier was not appropriate all and more of ofending one.I really apologize for that.
Thanks brother waseem for helping me to realize it.
Jazak Allah khairen |
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usmani790
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Wednesday, February 21, 2007 - 9:15 AM
Quote:-I would like to you to elaborate what non muslim activity is Ghamidhi propogating that makes him and people who agree with him non muslim.
I think that you got me wrong. I fear Allah for saying a Mulim person Kafir.This will be the last sin I will ever do in my life.What I mean by non Muslim scholars is that you used to quote the sayings of like Ghandi and many more western scholars oftenly. |
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waseem
UNITED KINGDOM
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Posted - Thursday, February 22, 2007 - 7:31 AM
Salam brother Usmani.
My love and respect for my religion remains paramount. However, if I read anything of substance outside religion, I like to share it with my fellow participants. This does not mean that I prefer them over the Qur'an (NAUZOBILLAH). If the particiapnts feel we should not quote anything outside our own religion then let me know and I will be guided by the views of the participants. |
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waseem
UNITED KINGDOM
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Posted - Thursday, February 22, 2007 - 7:34 AM
Salam brother Zulfi
Ghamidhi is labelled as munkareen i hadith in PK. This is because Ghamidhi believes that hadith is not a source of religion and the Qur'an and Sunnah are the only sources of religion. |
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Zulfee
USA
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Posted - Thursday, February 22, 2007 - 4:50 PM
quote:
There is NOTHING to EDIT in your POSTs. is there ANY?
IT IS HERE!!!!
ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
quote:
Normally , in such programs , opponents scholars do not have ability to counter Ghamidi Sahib on the base of arguments.
quote:
For any discussion, participant must be equal in scholastic level. The theme of program seems to me are to present the opinions of Ghamidi Sahib on the base of arguments.
What a RIDICULOUS….. and CHILDISH….. thinking is….!!!!!!!!
quote:
The traditional scholars do not have proper understanding of the principles on which Ghamidi Sahib presents his sum ups. These scholars do not have preparations to counter him on the base of arguments from Quran & Sunnah.
All the Hadith (fabricated stuff) believers including Ghamidi and your other favorite traditional scholars are the ‘TRADITIONALISTS…….’. They have NO concept of the Noble Qura’n. |
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imran776
UNITED KINGDOM
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Posted - Thursday, February 22, 2007 - 11:40 PM
WARNING Zulfee!
You have to mind your language otherwise according to the Code of Conduct on these forums, initially you will be blocked from the forums for a certain period of time and if you continued to use unacceptable language and personal targeting, we are afraid your registration will have to be cancelled.
wassalamu alaykum |
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ibrahim
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Friday, February 23, 2007 - 6:43 AM
| Thanks a lot Br Imran. I was Fed up too with Deleting his posts |
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salmant
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Friday, February 23, 2007 - 7:00 AM
| Another episode of the program "Ghamidi" will be aired at 8:05pm (PST) at Geo today. Your comments on the discussion in it are welcome here... |
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